As an update and further refutation to claims such as this one by another poor hopeful, I include some portraits of Ludwig van Beethoven which are considered to have been painted from life.
These portraits represent a spectrum of age from young adulthood to late in life. At no point do any of these portraits show any traits which are even remotely Negroid. The hair is straight. The nose is not broad and flat, as claimed. There is no prognathism. However, his hair is clearly black in his younger years in these paintings. It is not a stretch to suggest that this characteristic may have accounted for the “Der Schwarzer” reports, a la Eric the Red (you don’t hear anyone claiming that he was a Cherokee).
As further evidence, here are photos of his death mask. Note the angular nose and thin lips. The overall facial structure is decidedly Northern European.
As my final entry, here is a photo of a lock of Beethoven’s hair. There’s nothing sub-Saharan about that.
Myth debunked!
[...] More on the allegation that Beethoven was a mulatto. [...]
There are many mixed blacks, who look more european and have “straight” hair such as the one you are trying to illustrate with Beethoven. This proves nothing, and in the third portrait of Beethoven – he looks decidedly “mulatto”. This proves nothing.
Jean,
If you would like to present some sort of evidence here, I would be glad to read it. I’ve shown, pretty well, that there is absolutely no evidence which I can find which would in any way support the claims of Beethoven having African ancestors.
Hesperian
Jean, the point is why would anyone even think he was Black in the first place, absent some very compelling, well-publicized evidence? Because some people called him “Der Schwarzer”? As Hesperian said, that could be a reference to anything from hair color to a brooding disposition, for Pete’s sake.
I think Jean’s on to something. Several portraits show him have a distinctly broad nose, as well as the third portrait showing him with dark spongy hair. Also, prognathism is not a trait shared distinctly by all Africans. It seems that Hesperian has a weak argument.
And for future reference, terms such as “Negroid” are outdated and are usually taken as offensive. Choose your words carefully.
My mullato brother looks exactly like Beethoven… People get a life… What are you seeking? Seems to me that this sight is directed more for the racial extremist… then for an educated person looking for culture. I won’t come back here… Not because of the racism, but because it lacks inspiration and brings nothing to the mind…
Well said, wnc
i guess it is realy upseting you that beethoven is not caucazoid but realy is black, and geuss who else St George is black and has nothing to do with english history whatsoever, the current queen great great grandmother is black (queen charlotte) what does that make her now?
hitler had black hair but the paintings show it as blonde, i guess you will easily claim micheal jackson when he passes too despite of the way u slander him today, oh and here is another one jesus is black so is god, am sure you know that already and i also know i cannot stop you from going out of your way to plagarise every known thing for yourself, keep stealing as i keep creating
It’s very ignorant to say that Beethoven didn’t look ‘black’ as many mixed race people have very caucasian traits. I am Polish and Congolese, and have 2 sisters. Guess what? My older sister, Monika, has ‘white people’ hair, while I have an afro that is curly and nappy, while my baby sister, Patrycia has straight coarse hair… The wonders of DNA.
The following website has many arguments that Beethoven was mixed race, such as that his mother was a moor (African muslim) and that Beethoven was described as having dark skin,and did not look german at all. I quote from the site:
http://www.africawithin.com/kwaku/beethoven.htm
‘Frederick Hertz, German anthropologist, used these terms to describe him: “Negroid traits, dark skin, flat, thick nose.”
Finally, you say that a ‘poor hopeful’ wants to claim beethoven as part of the black heritage…
HONEY, we have so many astounding figures in the mixed and black culture, that we don’t need to lie about a white man’s origin to make ourselves look good…
In fact, there are many documented facts about Beethoven that point to the fact that he is of mixed race.
Also, mixed race would be black and WHITE. That means he would still be a celebrated european figure and you can STILL be proud to share his white blood.
As I have mentionned, I am Polish and Congolese, and guess what?
I take pride in my great grand father being in the AK, fighting against communism, being shipped off to a work camp in germany…I am still proud that Poland fought of the Ottoman empire and from the strenght of our people and our history.
I am ALSO SOOOO proud that I am from the Tetela tribe, in Congo who under the diection of Ngongo Leteta fought off Arabic slave trade AND for Patrice Lumumba, our first eleceted president, who was also a Tetela…
What I mean to say is that Beethoven might be mixed, but it shouldn’t take away any of his talent and your pride, because I am sure he was very proud of BOTH of his origins.
Jeanne,
I appreciate your comments. I wrote these posts about 1 1/2 years ago, and I think some of the wording was a little harsh. It’s certainly not my point to say that there aren’t or have never been any geniuses of African descent. I just don’t see the point in trying to prove that Beethoven had black ancestry when the case is so weak. The time could certainly be used more wisely.
Why bother? Black people these days claim that everyone is black, and that every region was civilized by Sub-saharan blacks. They see pictures of slaves and automatically say, aha, look, they’re really black! This is all nonsense and a result of the democratization of information. When any moron is given a tool to write an imaginary history, you end up with these sort of crazy ideas. Black people are so stupid and dumb that they claim the Moors were black. They also claim the Arabs are black, as well as the Indians, as well as the Irish, as well as the Greeks, and some even claim they civilized the Japanese.
This site will be attacked by Blacks, who will make up all kinds of crazy ignorant lies that defy history. These are the same people who claim they built the pyramids, civilized the Greeks, invaded Spain etc. They are thieves! The steal other people’s cultures and figures- They have written a fictitious history and they are teaching their children lies. I hope some time in the future they are punished for it. I hope the people whose history they are pilfering will fight back , and wage a war against this kind of savagery. Identity is what defines human beings. When a black person claims that Egyptian civilization, Moorish civilization, Greek civilization etc. is actually theirs, they are committing a crime!
I’m a Spanish myself, and that theory is completely crazy. First of all the moors and the blacks are not the same, and there a lot of both living here, so I can tell. Moors are more like semithic arabian and blacks look, well… like blacks.
The second question is how managed that nonsensical Spanish black moors to pass the trials of “clean blood” in order to not being kicked out of Spain during the several expulsion of jewish and moriscos, and furthermore join the Spanish “Tercios” for fighting in Flames. ¿He was called the black? Well, I remember my schooldays 20 years ago when black people were not as common as today, if a kid was darker than the average one he was automatically nicknamed “el negro” (the black). We had one nicknamed “el chino” (the chinese) too, and I’m quite sure he actually had not a single drop of asian blood in his veins.
As a matter of fact, there are loads of documents and writings proving that during the invasion -that lasted 700 years only for Granada, but 300 for some central areas and not a single year at all for northern places- blacks were no more than the slaves of the arabic ones, and the free african ones were the ancestors of the moroccoans and algerians, that are not black.
¿Beethoven a blackman? I wonder how much time I’ve to wait until somebody says the Roma Colosseum was built by black romans, and the Spanish gothic cathedrals by afrocaribbeans XD
Anyway, anything I say about is a complete waste of time, because Maria Magdalena Keverich -Beethoven’s mother, and daughter of Heinrich Keverich, chief overseer of the kitchen at the palace of the Elector of Trèves at Ehrenbreitstein-, has several records of his life and ancestry and, certainly, she was neither moor nor Spanish and, of course, not black at all.
I honestly feel sorry for “intellectual” blacks in their desperate attempt to make themselves feel relevent in a world where they simply are not. If it were not for the slave trade all blacks would be with their bretheren in central Africa starving to death.
They should simply accept their place in the world. There is nothing really wrong with their history and they should be proud of who they are are move on.
Being mulatto, you don’t have to look black all the time. Sometimes, people come here looking white. Some biracial people do look more black. Mulatto is generally half black half white. Beethoven, could have even been a quadroon. Not many people hear that word anymore, but they’re out there. There are folks you’ll never even know who you’re speaking to unless they tell you. I met a lady in Walmart the other day, I never never never would’ve guessed she was black. Be careful what you say around people, (you never know anyone’s real background, it’s silly to assume) because she was extremely proud to be a black woman, even though there was no trace whatsoever. NONE. Beethoven either took mostly white genes or he was so mixed that his blackness was almost mixed out. It will never be mixed out, because it took all these folks, black and white to create Beethoven. If one of them was missing, there would be no Beethoven. End of story.
There is always confusion with mulattoes, we don’t come with one look, you’re going to have one hell of a problem trying to disprive “mulatto-ness” without knowing someone’s parents. Good luck.
To me he looks mullato, particularly in his younger days and extremely so in the death mask, even his hair does.
I am mullato of the more caucasian looking kind. My mom is of Tobagian and a light brown skin tone, even though both her parents are dark brown skinned with broad features.
My dad is British and light skinned with light eyes. I came out very pale with blond wavy hair and features similar to the death mask posted, but many of my mulatto friends are darker with dark skin and dark eyes.
My girlfriend has a dark skinned black mother and a red haired white father with green eyes. Her (MY gf) eyes are blue and her hair is red with blond highlights but very curly. Her skin is also almost as light as mine, she has freckles and sun burns easily.
Also look at the mask at the bottom. that’s pretty convincing, I have more of a caucasian shape from the profile but I always looked at negroid features growing up to realize the differences. In that last mask we see the rounded forehead, prognathism of the upper jaw, broad cheek bones and rounded orbital lobes. His skull shape is more negroid than caucasian. Unless those masks are fake this man is definitely mixed race and partially black, there’s no doubt in my mind about it!